Dear Abby: sister "got religion"

[lemonsharks]

DEAR ABBY: I have a much older sister who has become very religious. Most of her life decisions are based on her faith, so conversations tend to develop into faith-oriented topics and justifications. I don’t initiate these conversations, and I make a genuine effort to understand her perspective. When I am not able to, I have mastered the “smile and nod.”

My problem is, anytime I bring a friend or date to a family function, she drags them off to the side and begins to question and discuss the importance of faith. Since religion is a widely varied and highly sensitive topic, this can sometimes be uncomfortable. I recently asked her to stop doing it, and I haven’t heard from her since. How can I explain healthy boundaries to her so we can have a respectful relationship? — YOUNGER BROTHER IN GEORGIA


DEAR YOUNGER BROTHER: If part of your sister’s religion is advancing it or converting others to her faith, you won’t be able to convince her to stop. I agree that what she’s doing can come across as obnoxious. Because you can’t control what she says or does, you may have to stop bringing friends or dates to family functions where you know she’ll be present. Otherwise, warn them in advance so they can either avoid being cornered or get away from her.

Comments

[minoanmiss]

... electrons died for that barely-an-answer. "Let your sister socially isolate you! Woot!"

[lemonsharks]

YEEEEEP.

LW is well within his rights to require that his family not invite him to places Sister is going to be, but the reality is that sister needs to STOP.

obviously I have more feelings about this below.

[minoanmiss]

"Sister needs to stop."

Word.

Capitulation. That was the word I wanted to use before, "spineless capitulation of an answer".

[azurelunatic]

TAKE the gift of her silence.

[lemonsharks]

YEP. Does LW even want to hear from her again? Because that's something he should think about if he has not done that yet.

[azurelunatic]

It sounds like he does; that's how I interpreted "boundaries"

... but really, at this point, he should reeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaaaaally consider that.

[lemonsharks]

I don't think LW should cede his right to bring a guest to family functions where guests are welcome, but I do agree that he needs to warn them about his sister first.

Someone also needs to establish a family culture of warning every guest and newbie about Sister.

"She's going to try and drag you off to a corner and lecture you about Jesus. You don't have to go with her if you're not interested."

(I'd like to accompany him to a function because someone needs to Southern Manners at her until she shuts up, and I have both the training and inclination to do it with a punch.)

[minoanmiss]

Let me know if you get an invitation, I'll start saving up bail money.

[bikergeek]

Someone also needs to establish a family culture of warning every guest and newbie about Sister.

Sounds like a classic Missing Stair to me. I know the term is commonly (maybe almost exclusively, at this point?) applied to sexual predators and abusers, but I've seen it used in other contexts too, about any person in a social group whose behavior has to be "managed" and about whom noobs are warned.

[lemonsharks]

Yeah, warning for the missing stair is predicated on the idea that they won't be expelled from family events until/unless they stop being tools

[mommy]

I mean, the advice isn't wrong. It sounds like LW's sister converted into a faith that emphasizes converting others as quickly and frequently as possible, which means that this behavior is her current default and that any attempt to get her tone it down will sound like a direct attack on her religion from her perspective. LW's options are to either continue with things as-is or to opt out of interacting with his sister.

[minoanmiss]

"any attempt to get her tone it down will sound like a direct attack on her religion from her perspective"

I grew up being told this. And it didn't take me that long to realize that the people teaching me our then-shared religion were making a deliberate choice to view being asked to tone it down as a Direct Religious Attack.

This situation reminds me of the adage "your right to swing your fist ends just before where my nose begins." Sister forcing other people to participate in her religion with her (as Trying To COnvert People is one of her religious practices) is over the nose line, I think.

[mommy]

Yeah, I've had to deal with the Recently Converted. There's a reason those people aren't in my life now.

[adrian_turtle]

"any attempt to get her to tone it down will sound like a direct attack on her religion from her perspective"

Isn't this why "Bless your heart" was invented?

[lemonsharks]

I'm firmly on team, "Sister is going to feel attacked about her religion, so let her feel attacked. It's not the worst thing happening here. Do not let sister prostheletize to your guests, which is the worst thing happening here."

[mommy]

Ideally, yes. LW has three options:

1: Let things continue. His guests get proselytized at. Not ideal.
2: Avoid avoid avoid! His guests never meet her, so she can't be a nuisance to them. Better!
3: Confrontation. Let her pick a fight. Success requires support from the people around LW.

In my experience, Option 3 just results in a mix of Options 1 and 2. I find it simpler to make the choice on my own, since there's a point where the opinions of people like the sister stop mattering to me. I usually pick Option 2.

[naath]

I assume LW continues to car for sis, because if not he could simply cut her out, she's being seriously awful to his guests here. But... if he says 'hey sis quit it' then chances are good her fellow cultits say 'oh gosh, isn't your brother awful' and this pushes her further into their arms and away from her pre-conversion friends/family. This kind of obnoxious behaviour is a common way to alienate the new cultist from any outside life, this making them more dependent on the cult; if LW wants to get sis out of there... there are organisations that can help (I have no idea).

If sis has joined a reasonable faith her co religionists should be on board with the 'unwanted proselytizing is not cool' train, focussing her desire to relate her joy in the faith to places/times where that is wanted by the audience.

[lemonsharks]

Un/fortunately, not all evangelical religions are by definition cults, and her new faith family could very well double down on encouraging her to keep doing the thing/supporting her doing without actually abusing her or working to separate her from her nonreligious network.

The letter is giving me STRONG vibes of Jehovah's Witnesses (which is a cult), which complicates things as you described.

[kellyblah]

so glad I checked, I was about to come in to post this one.

I agree that what she’s doing can come across as obnoxious.

No. No, this is obnoxious, full stop.

I am another person with so many feelings on this topic, having married into a family with an evangelical streak. There are so many mental hangups tied up with the person that "evangelises" at gatherings. It's... just... gak. ugh.

[julian]

Hey, haven't heard from her since, that's kind of a positive!

OK, not so much, he seems to want her in his life. (I mean. He doesn't *need* to...)

This "do not bring people to family functions" is not workable. Warn them in advance, and rescue at need. And make it clear it *is* a rescue, thus showing her how anti-social she's being. Which is, yes, as mommy said, picking a fight, but you sometimes need to.

[lemonsharks]

The trick is figuring out how to not care about Sister's feelings on this issue, and how to not care about Family's feelings about Sister around this issue.

LW (or anyone tbh) doesn't have to be deliberately unkind about it, but carefully and strategically deployed indifference toward the feelings of others is a powerful tool.

[julian]

Yes. And if you're not used to doing it, it's hard to maintain, so: prepare.

[conuly]

I recently asked her to stop doing it, and I haven’t heard from her since. How can I explain healthy boundaries to her so we can have a respectful relationship?

You probably can't. Luckily, you don't need to explain boundaries to enforce them.