Care & Feeding: I Don't Want My Husband To Teach Our Child Creole

[minoanmiss]

I am currently pregnant. My husband who is American and born to Haitian parents wants to teach our son Haitian Creole. I am apprehensive about this because Creole is not even an official language and it almost seems regressive for our son to learn Creole. The fact is French is the official language of Haiti, but only 5 percent of the population speak French because of limited education of the country. There are three dialects of Creole and my husband doesn’t even know which one he speaks. Additionally, he cannot even read or write in Creole. Creole is not a real language and I feel as though it’s not worth it for him to teach our son. I suggested he teach our son French instead. I’d prefer it over Creole. He says he won’t, and wants to teach him Creole. Am I wrong to think this way? We live in America, and we are both American. I want to focus on teaching our son English and mastering the English language first. What should I do?

—Language Differences

Dear Language Differences,

Why is it so difficult for you to accept that your husband wants to share what he knows about his own culture with your child? What’s at the root of your discomfort with raising a multilingual child? What’s stopping you from teaching your child English and French while your husband teaches him a Creole dialect? What’s driving this (erroneous) preoccupation you have with “real” and “official” language?

I want you to really sit with your answers to these questions. Take some time considering why you’re harboring such strong resistance to your husband imparting lessons on his (and your child’s) shared cultural identity. You married someone Haitian American. Your child, the grandchild of Haitian grandparents, will have and should learn about his Haitian heritage. Get comfortable with that reality.

One of the reasons languages and dialects are lost (or become categorized as “unofficial” by people living outside their lands of origin) is those languages are not passed down from one generation to the next. Their nuances are gradually ceded to the assimilation native speakers have deemed necessary to survive. It’s no coincidence that your husband doesn’t read or write in the Creole dialect he learned. He is trying to prevent what spoken dialect he knows from being lost to his child. He wants to pass down what he and his family have worked hard to retain. There’s nothing at all objectionable about that.

You asked if you’re “wrong to think this way,” and the answer is yes, Language Differences. Your attitude in this letter reads as not just wrong but xenophobic and racist. Despite that, I do hope you’re all able to reach an agreement on this issue that works in the best interests of your child.

—Stacia

Comments

[cereta]

Hi! Person who knows just enough linguistics to be dangerous, here.

Any creole is, by definition, a "real language." That is what differentiates a pigdin from a creole: that people use it as their first language.

(Fun fact: English a creole. One of the languages that formed it was French. How many English speakers speak French?)

So, you know: go pound sand, LW.

[fox]

[shorter fox: cereta is right!]

Hi! Person with three degrees in linguistics, here.

A creole is a “real” language. Hatian Creole is so firmly established that I’m not even confident it is strictly accurate to call it a creole anymore; it is a language whose name is Creole.

LW is a racist and a snob and she should feel bad about herself.

[conuly]

English is not a creole. There is absolutely no evidence for the English = creole hypothesis. English is a straight up, noncreolized Germanic language with a lot of loanwords.

But everything else is correct.

[shirou]

LW, your son will want to learn your husband's language. It will be an important part of his connection to his people. Please allow it.

My family immigrated to the US from the Netherlands, and I grew up bilingual. I often went back to NL as a child (we still had a house) and do so occasionally now. Most Dutch people speak English, so I could have managed fine with that, but being able to speak with my family and random people in Dutch helped me feel like they were still my people, and NL still my country, even though I didn't live there. Common language forms a bond.

I guess you wouldn't dispute that Dutch is a "real" language, but from a practicality standpoint, it's useless. Few people speak Dutch, and extremely few speak only Dutch. But I'm glad I speak it. It's my language.

[azurelunatic]

and if it bothers you that your kid has a language you don't, you can try learning it too.

[petrea_mitchell]

Yes! Why not learn more about the culture and background of the actual person you chose to marry?

[green_grrl]

Why is it so difficult for you to accept that your husband wants to share what he knows about his own culture with your child? What’s at the root of your discomfort with raising a multilingual child? What’s stopping you from teaching your child English and French while your husband teaches him a Creole dialect? What’s driving this (erroneous) preoccupation you have with “real” and “official” language?

The answer is racism.

Also, there’s absolutely no reason why child can’t learn English, Creole, and French—everybody wins, especially trilingual child.

[redbird]

One of my online friends and her partner are raising their children trilingual: she talks (and sings, and reads) to them in Russian, he talks to them in Cantonese, and they speak English to each other. They also hear their parents speaking Russian and Cantonese to the respective grandparents.

That's three languages for now, they'll learn French in school.

Oh, my friend happens to be a linguist.

[dine]

Stacia's response to LW, Your attitude in this letter reads as not just wrong but xenophobic and racist. is so on target.

babies/small children are easily able to learn multiple languages - it might take a little while for them to sort them out, but they get there. having a second (or third) language is a GOOD thing! and creole is definitely a 'Real' language (see above comment by cereta)

my family stopped speaking German, even at home, when WWII started. as a result, we all lost that language and a connection to our heritage. although once when dozing on the couch and startled awake, my dad sat bolt upright and said "was ist das?" so a little bit stuck in his subconscious from his childhood.

[cimorene]

I weep for children like this. And I hope the LW listens, but they might not. Most people don't know linguistics or childhood development. The fact is that there are no downsides to learning more languages, but racist, nationalistic and xenophobic junk science was pushed on people as propaganda for decades causing so many parents to raise their children without their native languages, thinking they were doing what was best for them, and causing a lot of grief for second generation immigrants all over the world. This notion of "pure" or "official" or "legitimate" languages and varieties is unfortunately a common sort of poison spread in colonized and conquered nations, and in the US, where prescriptivism and ignorant pronouncements often still equate non standard dialects with lack of fluency.

My wife had a coworker who shared only 1 language with her husband that neither was fluent in and it's all they were speaking to their toddler, and that's a surprisingly common occurrence in the world, considering the evidence of bi- (tri-, etc) lingualism has been clearly available at least in many parts of the world for, no doubt, all of recorded history.

[ioplokon]

Also there is actually a massive need for creole speakers, and especially bilingual English-Creyole speakers, in a lot of the US?

[jamoche]

I was just on hold with a California govt service and one hold message said they could help in over 170 languages, so yeah, I imagine there are jobs for the asking if you speak the less common ones.

[petrea_mitchell]

Not much of the US counting by individual states, but it's the third most spoken language in Florida. (Fun fact that I learned via work. The software I work on supports Haitian Creole because we have a big customer in Florida.)

[petrea_mitchell]

Really wish the LW had been called out on this:

The fact is French is the official language of Haiti

Haitian Creole is also an official language of Haiti.

but only 5 percent of the population speak French because of limited education of the country.

No, it's because French is a weird niche language that no one outside of that niche feels a need to learn.

[petrea_mitchell]

Also, re: "regressive", I would think that applies to the language hanging on to archaic spellings that have less and less to do with how words are actually pronounced. Creole spelling is much better than French.

[jadelennox]

I am resentful that I never learned my grandparents' first language, in which my dad was also fluent, but at the time, LW's attitudes were the social norm: you should reject the poor people language of your refugee origins.

Now we know that not only post-colonial understandings of culture, but entirely apolitical knowledge of childhood brain development, shows that attitude is bogus. If husband's first language is Kreyòl (unclear) then it will actually improve the child's English literacy if the dad speaks to him in Kreyòl. Moreover, it's quite possible that the husband is uncomfortable with his own lack of literacy in his parents' native language wants having his own son to be a jumping off point for connecting with that native language, and more power to you, husband! I don't know if his parents are still alive but god I wish I'd learned Yiddish while my grandparents or at least my dad were still around.

I am really curious as to whether LW is Black or not. Is this barely-hidden anti-Black racism, or is it internalized colonial anti "shithole country" BS? I'm comparing to the way 20th century Jews dissed Yiddish; Yiddish's secular revival notably didn't start until the Yiddish-speaking generations -- the poor people from the shithole shtetlach -- we mostly gone. (Modern Yiddish as-a-first-language chassidim have basically no cultural overlap with secular speakers, and given their standard age of marriage are probably more several more generations of American born than non-chassidic Jews.)

[minoanmiss]

I am really curious as to whether LW is Black or not. Is this
barely-hidden anti-Black racism, or is it internalized colonial anti "shithole country" BS?

Yeah, I asked the exact same questions, around/during my blinding fury.

[ambyr]

I did not learn my dad's dying first language, and I regret it to this day (though not enough to try to pick it up as an adult). There is no downside to a kid learning another language. The knots this LW is twisting themselves into to justify their racism are painful to see.

I'm a polyglot

[librarygeek]

Polyglot, not multilingual here. Mum and Grandmere spoke French around me, my Dad's side had Yiddish and Spanish, Hebrew for prayers on both sides. Everyone speaks English as well.

Maternal grandmother (English and German Jew) spoke rather disdainfully of Yiddish, and didn't use it, preferring French and Hebrew.

In high school, when I was taking French 3, I was paired with a Haitian classmate because I understood her speech and only the teacher understood her otherwise, not our other classmates. I can usually communicate with people, if I have even a base language in common. My teen taught themselves classical Greek to read Homer and history of Alexander the Great, and is learning Chinese for a favorite donghua, Heaven Official's Blessing.

We did use American Sign Language with the teen as a baby, on top of the other household languages.

Sometimes I like not understanding why (mostly American) people are proud of only speaking one language...

Re: I'm a polyglot

[minoanmiss]

I am in AWE of you.

When I was about 9 or 10 I said in exasperation to my parents, "Why did you move from one English speaking country to another?" (they're Jamaican and raised me in the US) "All the other immigrant kids I know are bilingual or more! But I only know English!" They were amused.

[vindoletta]

This sentiment is not unique to people from different countries or skin color. In my country, Spain, there's this same attitude against minoritarian/minorized languages such as Galician, Euskera, etc. I've read it's also common in the UK against Gaelic and Scottish. I feel like it's not a coincidence that both countries were colonial powers.

I hope the husband teaches the kid Creole nonetheless. If the wife objects, he could remind her that the US has no official language.

[petrea_mitchell]

It's not just the Western colonialist powers. Japan spent a long time pushing the idea that there was only one Japanese people and one Japanese language, trying to strangle the language and culture of the Ainu and the Ryukyuan peoples. It has only started to relent in the last few years. Or see China and how it currently treats any of its indigenous minorities, and probably many other examples I'm not familiar with.

[starwatcher]

I am so on board with learning multiple languages. My dad's first language was Italian; his grandparents (first care-givers because both parents worked) didn't speak English. Unfortunately, as mentioned elsethread, in those days people hid their 'non-(American)-standard cultural experiences'; he didn't even attempt to teach us kids any Italian, although he spoke it fluently until his grandmother died when I was about 1-1/2. I mourn that; it might have helped my brain be flexible enough to learn other languages. I had 2 or 3 years each of Latin, French, and Spanish, and can't speak any of them; by the time I was exposed to them (in junior high and high school), my brain just wouldn't "let go" of English. I can kinda-sorta puzzle out the meaning of simple written sentences in those languages, but no more.

At least my recognition of missed opportunities led me to offer reassurances when Spanish-speaking students were embarrassed by not knowing a specific English word. Although New Mexico is officially a bilingual state, too many children still seem to get shamed if they stumble over an English word or phrase. I simply gave them the needed word, accompanied by a little verbal approval about how cool it was that they knew two languages, and that they should keep speaking both, because bosses would be looking for that when they became old enough to work. I'll never know, but I hope it helped some of them along the line...

[heavenscalyx]

One of my godchildren is biracial and is furious that they never got to learn Tagalog because their grandparents stopped their children from speaking it when they moved to the US, and so the children never spoke it to the grandchildren. They are trying to pick it up, but they're very frustrated about it.

I hope the answer was pointed enough that LW reconsiders.

[sara]

You are blessed to have a multilingual partner who wants to be an engaged enough father and teach his child his language and you're being picky about it?

Clearly LW does not realize what most women would give to have a man in their child's life who wants to teach that kid ANYTHING. LW does not deserve this dude.

[minoanmiss]

LW does not deserve this dude.

Yeah, when I first posted this I wrote and deleted three different comments that were 500 words of "LW does not deserve this dude" plus armwaving.

[ayebydan]

LW is racist. End of

[lemonsharks]

I want to know if LW is white or a nonimmigrant-kid African American, or another nonwhite ethnicity distant from immigrant roots.

Because the context changes from "get away from this woman and aggressively pursue physical and decision-making custody" with a white woman to "ugh this is going to be hard but y'all can probably work it out" with a nonwhite (Black?) woman.

But since LW wrote in and not her partner, I wish the advice had capped out what this is likely largely about: LW does not want her baby, its father, and its paternal grandparents to share a language she does not speak, which smacks of control issues even absent the (large) racism/xenophobia issues.