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Two letters on boundaries from the same column
1. This first letter was posted here after being printed in a different column
Dear Prudence,
Kelly, Susan, Stacy, and I have been friends since we shared a suite in college. I’m Nigerian and Kelly is Japanese; Susan and Stacy are white. Lately, this has led to a big disconnect in how they believe Kelly and I should resolve problems with our families. They are very comfortable with just cutting family members off and/or issuing boundaries and then cutting people off, which is basically anathema to the closely knit immigrant communities and family-based cultures Kelly and I grew up in, but they don’t understand why we won’t just “hold our parents accountable” for our childhood trauma, even though we’ve explained that it really wouldn’t make sense to them.
For example, my mother remarried less than a year after my father died, and Susan’s father also remarried shortly after her parents got divorced. But I know my mother felt pressured to do so by her relatives, and she was alone with a child just two years after immigrating to a new country, so I can understand why she believed it was the safest choice for us (even though I was very angry about it at the time). Susan thinks I should have reduced contact with my mother, the way she did with her dad and stepmother when she turned 18, and she and Stacy have similarly urged Kelly to set boundaries with her parents whenever she’s vented about them. Kelly and I have both explained that we understand where they’re coming from, but that this logic would make no sense to our parents, who grew up in multi-generational, impoverished households. We both feel confident that we won’t replicate our parents’ behavior with our future children, but that doesn’t mean we want them out of our lives, or that we won’t provide for them after seeing how many sacrifices they’ve made for us. It’s gotten to the point where we can’t even bring up family issues without hearing speeches about how we need to break free of our oppressive cultures and parents. How can we get it through to our friends that their methods of dealing with white upper middle-class family members don’t translate to our African and Asian immigrant families? It’s getting seriously frustrating.
—Aggrieved By Advice
Dear Aggrieved,
Here’s an example of how the conversation could go:
You: I have to return my mom’s call before we go out.
Roommate: No you don’t! Set a boundary! She’s made so many bad choices that have hurt you!
You: I know you’re saying that because you care about me and want to protect me, but every culture and every family is different. What might work for you won’t work for me. I want us to continue to be close as roommates and talk about our lives but since I’m happy with my relationship with my mom, I’d just appreciate it if you didn’t pressure me to change it.
If you feel like your friendship is going to be a lasting one, it’s definitely worth having a more detailed conversation about your cultural values around family, where they come from, and what they mean to you. Someone who is going to be an important part of your life for the rest of your college years and beyond should want to understand that rather than trying to reshape your life to look like theirs.
2. Dear Prudence,
I am from a large family—two brothers and four sisters. I am the only one that didn’t immediately get married and pop out babies after college and it left a great division between me and the rest of my family. I am the only one that seems to make an effort here. I call them. They don’t call me. I visit them. They don’t visit me.
When I do visit I am either auntie-the-free-babysitter or sad-single-sister-who-can’t-settle-down. The pandemic put an end to my even trying. Between two moves, a new house, and a new job I had enough on my hands. I have two nieces I haven’t even met in person. I keep up with everyone on social media and the effort just leaves me feeling numb and depressed. But I am still terrified about going no contact.
What should I do? Bringing the topic up either gets me called crazy or selfish. Several years ago, I landed a huge promotion and in my excitement, I called my mom and told her she will never guess what happened to me. She jumped right into thinking I was pregnant. And was obviously disappointed when I said “No, I got the job.” When this upset me, everyone in the family shut me down and told me it was a natural response from my mom and I was making a mountain out of a molehill.
—Black Sheep
Dear Black Sheep,
Going no contact is an option that will always be available to you, but let’s not jump to that right away. Don’t get me wrong, your family sounds pretty disappointing. But before you cut them off, I’d like for you to think about how your ideal relationship would look—how much time you’d like to spend together, what activities you’d like to do, how much babysitting you will (not) be available for, the kinds of comments you don’t want to hear. Then, make that clear to them and see whether they can fall in line. It might also be helpful to think of them as individual people with their own personalities and life circumstances rather than one big unit that’s completely against you. For example, do you have an aunt who you’d like to talk to on the phone once a month (but never about anyone’s babies including the ones you might or might not have in the future)? Do you want your mom to celebrate your professional achievements with you? Do you want your siblings to stop running out the door for date night whenever you set foot in their homes? How about an annual trip with them with no kids? Do you want your nieces and nephews to know you as the fun, cool aunt? Would you like their parents to tell you what their interests are so you can start to form your own relationship with them?
Whatever it is, tell people individually what you need. Give them a chance. And offer your siblings a little grace (or, if it feels better, pity them a bit!). Their “pop out babies” lifestyle may be what they chose, but it likely means they’re exhausted, flustered, and perhaps at times even a little envious of the life you’ve been able to create for yourself. I think there’s a way that you can salvage these connections, but as the person who wants everyone to behave and think differently than they have up until this point, you will need to be the one to lead the way.
Link
Dear Prudence,
Kelly, Susan, Stacy, and I have been friends since we shared a suite in college. I’m Nigerian and Kelly is Japanese; Susan and Stacy are white. Lately, this has led to a big disconnect in how they believe Kelly and I should resolve problems with our families. They are very comfortable with just cutting family members off and/or issuing boundaries and then cutting people off, which is basically anathema to the closely knit immigrant communities and family-based cultures Kelly and I grew up in, but they don’t understand why we won’t just “hold our parents accountable” for our childhood trauma, even though we’ve explained that it really wouldn’t make sense to them.
For example, my mother remarried less than a year after my father died, and Susan’s father also remarried shortly after her parents got divorced. But I know my mother felt pressured to do so by her relatives, and she was alone with a child just two years after immigrating to a new country, so I can understand why she believed it was the safest choice for us (even though I was very angry about it at the time). Susan thinks I should have reduced contact with my mother, the way she did with her dad and stepmother when she turned 18, and she and Stacy have similarly urged Kelly to set boundaries with her parents whenever she’s vented about them. Kelly and I have both explained that we understand where they’re coming from, but that this logic would make no sense to our parents, who grew up in multi-generational, impoverished households. We both feel confident that we won’t replicate our parents’ behavior with our future children, but that doesn’t mean we want them out of our lives, or that we won’t provide for them after seeing how many sacrifices they’ve made for us. It’s gotten to the point where we can’t even bring up family issues without hearing speeches about how we need to break free of our oppressive cultures and parents. How can we get it through to our friends that their methods of dealing with white upper middle-class family members don’t translate to our African and Asian immigrant families? It’s getting seriously frustrating.
—Aggrieved By Advice
Dear Aggrieved,
Here’s an example of how the conversation could go:
You: I have to return my mom’s call before we go out.
Roommate: No you don’t! Set a boundary! She’s made so many bad choices that have hurt you!
You: I know you’re saying that because you care about me and want to protect me, but every culture and every family is different. What might work for you won’t work for me. I want us to continue to be close as roommates and talk about our lives but since I’m happy with my relationship with my mom, I’d just appreciate it if you didn’t pressure me to change it.
If you feel like your friendship is going to be a lasting one, it’s definitely worth having a more detailed conversation about your cultural values around family, where they come from, and what they mean to you. Someone who is going to be an important part of your life for the rest of your college years and beyond should want to understand that rather than trying to reshape your life to look like theirs.
2. Dear Prudence,
I am from a large family—two brothers and four sisters. I am the only one that didn’t immediately get married and pop out babies after college and it left a great division between me and the rest of my family. I am the only one that seems to make an effort here. I call them. They don’t call me. I visit them. They don’t visit me.
When I do visit I am either auntie-the-free-babysitter or sad-single-sister-who-can’t-settle-down. The pandemic put an end to my even trying. Between two moves, a new house, and a new job I had enough on my hands. I have two nieces I haven’t even met in person. I keep up with everyone on social media and the effort just leaves me feeling numb and depressed. But I am still terrified about going no contact.
What should I do? Bringing the topic up either gets me called crazy or selfish. Several years ago, I landed a huge promotion and in my excitement, I called my mom and told her she will never guess what happened to me. She jumped right into thinking I was pregnant. And was obviously disappointed when I said “No, I got the job.” When this upset me, everyone in the family shut me down and told me it was a natural response from my mom and I was making a mountain out of a molehill.
—Black Sheep
Dear Black Sheep,
Going no contact is an option that will always be available to you, but let’s not jump to that right away. Don’t get me wrong, your family sounds pretty disappointing. But before you cut them off, I’d like for you to think about how your ideal relationship would look—how much time you’d like to spend together, what activities you’d like to do, how much babysitting you will (not) be available for, the kinds of comments you don’t want to hear. Then, make that clear to them and see whether they can fall in line. It might also be helpful to think of them as individual people with their own personalities and life circumstances rather than one big unit that’s completely against you. For example, do you have an aunt who you’d like to talk to on the phone once a month (but never about anyone’s babies including the ones you might or might not have in the future)? Do you want your mom to celebrate your professional achievements with you? Do you want your siblings to stop running out the door for date night whenever you set foot in their homes? How about an annual trip with them with no kids? Do you want your nieces and nephews to know you as the fun, cool aunt? Would you like their parents to tell you what their interests are so you can start to form your own relationship with them?
Whatever it is, tell people individually what you need. Give them a chance. And offer your siblings a little grace (or, if it feels better, pity them a bit!). Their “pop out babies” lifestyle may be what they chose, but it likely means they’re exhausted, flustered, and perhaps at times even a little envious of the life you’ve been able to create for yourself. I think there’s a way that you can salvage these connections, but as the person who wants everyone to behave and think differently than they have up until this point, you will need to be the one to lead the way.
Link
no subject