minoanmiss: Theran girl gathering saffron (Saffron-Gatherer)
minoanmiss ([personal profile] minoanmiss) wrote in [community profile] agonyaunt2021-03-05 01:03 pm

Dear Prudence: My sister thinks I ruined my nephew's life



Q. Nephew: About six months ago, there was a rash of vandalism and burglaries in our town. Most people blamed local teenagers who were doing virtual school but whose parents still worked. I am lucky enough to work from home, and on my lunch I went out for a run. There was a foreclosed house at the bottom of the hill, and I had the perfect view to watch a group of teenagers break in. I called the cops. All the kids were caught red-handed, including my 15-year-old nephew “Billy,” who I didn’t realize was there.

Everyone in my family was shocked because Billy has never been in trouble in his life. I didn’t see him, and Billy swears up and down they were just exploring and weren’t going to vandalize the house. It was just this “once.” Unfortunately, his “friends” confessed to other crimes (and had drugs on them) and dragged Billy down with them. He pleaded down and got sentenced to several hundred hours of community and three years probation. His parents were out nearly $9,000 between the lawyer fees and restitution. Billy is no longer eligible for school sports, and this has seriously affected his chances at college (he is a great athlete and his parents don’t make a lot).

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I felt horror when I found out Billy was involved, but looking back, I don’t think there was anything I could have done without being psychic. My sister blames me. She hopes I am “happy”’ about “ruining” her son’s life. I haven’t said anything back because I knew she was under stress. And worse, other people in our family have started to agree with her. I ended up having a serious fight with my parents because they keep lamenting Billy’s future and think it is my fault. I ended up yelling at them—when all the vandalism started, all they could do is vent about bad kids and their awful parents. My mother said she was afraid to leave home some days. If they wanted to blame anyone, Billy is right there. No one forced him at gunpoint to break into that house or hang around with bad kids. I don’t know what to do here.

A: You can’t go back in time and undo what you did, of course. Without getting too off-topic, I think the bank foreclosing on someone’s home (especially in a pandemic) is a much graver offense than a bunch of teens breaking into an empty house, and had you been able to seek my advice in the moment, I’d have advised you to reconsider calling the police. While it’s true that Billy was not forced at gunpoint into that house, neither were you—you didn’t witness a violent crime, you knew that no one was living inside, and it’s entirely possible that this group of teens breaking into an empty house was not also responsible for for other acts of vandalism in town. For whatever it’s worth, I don’t think vandalism or drug possession merits the kind of response Billy and his friends have received, but again, what’s done is done, and you can’t take back what’s already happened.

I think you’ve done the right thing in holding your tongue while your sister expressed her anger. That anger is understandable—not least because it cost her and her husband thousands of dollars on an already-strained budget just to ensure their son received legal representation—but that doesn’t mean their every conclusion or fear for the future is necessarily accurate. You do not have to affirm their predictions that Billy’s life is ruined forever; he’s experienced serious financial setbacks and will be monitored and restricted by the state for several years, but his record can be expunged and there will be more to his life story than this. You can acknowledge that this has been painful and expensive for their family and their anger makes sense without conceding that you single-handedly or willfully “ruined his life” forever.

I’m not sure you’ll be able to repair your relationship with your sister anytime soon, so be as patient as you can on that front. Give them some time. In the meantime, if the rest of your relatives want to work out their own frustrations by endlessly revisiting the subject, you can draw back from those conversations. It may be worth considering whether you would do anything differently if you had the chance to do it over again; if you still think you made the best choice available, then further conversations on the subject probably won’t be profitable.
katiedid717: (Default)

[personal profile] katiedid717 2021-03-05 07:04 pm (UTC)(link)
I'm wondering why/how the LW's sister knows LW is the one who called it in. Did LW hear the little Billy had been arrested and feel so guilty that they felt the need to confess? Was LW talking about calling the cops on the teens because it was relevant to a conversation and then got "Well your nephew was involved and you've RUINED HIS LIFE" in response?
sporky_rat: Luna Lovegood making friends with a thestral. (luna)

[personal profile] sporky_rat 2021-03-05 07:41 pm (UTC)(link)

I'd really like to know what Billy thinks of his aunt/uncle's actions.

Also, seriously, Billy may actually have never been in any trouble before or he may not have gotten caught before.

Even as a wild and rambunctious twelve year old, I knew who I wouldn't want to get caught hanging around because I'd end up tarred with the same brush. Billy's life might actually have not been ruined by this, it might have been a very educational experience.

(Wow I sound like such a square. Small town, everyone is watching everyone, what did these kids think was going to happen?)

Edited (Spelling, ugh, mobile keyboard, stop with the assumptions) 2021-03-05 19:42 (UTC)
cereta: (Mary Jane)

[personal profile] cereta 2021-03-05 08:39 pm (UTC)(link)
If respecting other people's ability to feel safe in their homes and to not have to pay to replace stolen items/clean up vandalism makes you square, just call me Squarey McSquareson.
sporky_rat: Alfred Bester:B5 looking very amused, text:'*sporfle*" (b5)

[personal profile] sporky_rat 2021-03-06 12:00 am (UTC)(link)

The McSquareson Clan, respecting people's ability to feel safe in their homes and not having to pay replacement for vandalized or stolen things!

conuly: (Default)

[personal profile] conuly 2021-03-05 09:10 pm (UTC)(link)
It was broad daylight, and they apparently weren't making any serious effort not to be seen, so yes, this does not sound like the brightest group of teen troublemakers.
cereta: Are you my mummy? (Parker gasmask)

[personal profile] cereta 2021-03-05 08:36 pm (UTC)(link)
I admit that I have, for obvious reasons, been very, very reluctant lately to call the police for anything short of violent crime (although I admit to some resentment that I have no recourse for things like the roofing company working on the house next door repeatedly blocking my driveway or people playing music so loud that it rattles my walls). That said, it sounds like this one instance was in a foreclosed house. If the other instances involved burglary, then it seems almost certain that the houses in question were still in the possession of owners/renters who lived there. I would certainly hope that if someone saw a bunch of kids vandalizing or breaking into my home while we were gone, they would do something about it. I admit to some bias, here, as we've dealt with both vandalism and break-ins (one of which we are pretty sure was some kind of teenage dare), but I'm really bothered by the fact that this answer doesn't even consider the financial and emotional fallout for the people who live in those houses.
conuly: (Default)

[personal profile] conuly 2021-03-05 09:09 pm (UTC)(link)
Interesting that Sis and the entire extended family are blaming LW instead of any or all of: Billy, his friends who were foolish enough to carry drugs with them while trespassing and then to say anything more to the police than "I want a lawyer/my parents", the criminal justice system, themselves....

If you ask me, LW should immediately hang up the phone if any of them brings it up again. There's nothing new to be said.

(As for whether or not LW should've called the police, I admit that I probably would've restricted myself to simply calling out to the kids to scram, but since the fault here ultimately lies in our society for having brutal cops, I'll just leave it there.)
heavenscalyx: (Default)

[personal profile] heavenscalyx 2021-03-05 10:54 pm (UTC)(link)
My inclination is that, no, I probably wouldn’t have called the cops, but what’s done is done, and if Billy is a white cishet boy, his life is fine. Oh boohoo, he can’t play sportsball. (I have zero sorrow for pulling someone out of the toxic masculinity sump of organized sportsball.) Maybe he should look omln it as an opportunity to focus on his academics instead.
jadelennox: Senora Sabasa Garcia, by Goya (Default)

[personal profile] jadelennox 2021-03-06 12:28 am (UTC)(link)
I think the bank foreclosing on someone’s home (especially in a pandemic) is a much graver offense than a bunch of teens breaking into an empty house, and had you been able to seek my advice in the moment, I’d have advised you to reconsider calling the police. While it’s true that Billy was not forced at gunpoint into that house, neither were you—you didn’t witness a violent crime, you knew that no one was living inside, and it’s entirely possible that this group of teens breaking into an empty house was not also responsible for for other acts of vandalism in town.


this this this.

It sucks that the only people we can call are all Schrödinger's Murderers. It also sucks that the penalties in the carceral state are so off the wall that even minors can end up with unsealed records. It sucks that, depending on the laws where you live, a teenager who's been caught once before with a beer or a joint can find themselves in juvie -- in a pandemic -- because they break into an empty house, and that juvie in some states almost guarantees the kid will end up in prison as an adult. It absolutely fucking sucks that we've learned that the system of people who are supposed to protect us is so corrupt and vile that all it does is ruin lives.

It sucks, but it's true.

If the kids were breaking into an empty house, nobody was at immediate risk. Ring a couple of your neighbors' doorbells, get together a scary-looking posse of work from home guys, and then show up at the house and put the fear of god into them. Call neighborhood watch, if you have them, or crisis response, or the truancy officers. Or let it go.

jadelennox: Senora Sabasa Garcia, by Goya (Default)

[personal profile] jadelennox 2021-03-06 01:17 am (UTC)(link)
yeah, I don't trust Neighborhood Watches, either, and truancy officers can have the power to send the parents to jail. I'd also let it go. But I understand why calling nobody makes some people more nervous, so I'm trying to find recourses that aren't the police.

conuly: (Default)

[personal profile] conuly 2021-03-06 05:07 am (UTC)(link)
Neighborhood Watch can be a lot worse than the cops. Even the police side-eye some of them for sheer sketchiness. Wasn't George Zimmerman a neighborhood watch dude?
lilysea: Serious (Default)

[personal profile] lilysea 2021-03-06 07:50 am (UTC)(link)
I would have called the Police, BUT I live in Australia where the Police are a lot less murder-y.

[All the Police shootings I've ever seen in the news in Australia - and they are quite rare - have involved the person who was shot waving a knife/axe/gun around]

In the US?

I MIGHT have called the Police if the teens were white;

if the teens were Black/Latinx, I don't think I would have called the Police for breaking into an unoccupied house - too much risk of the teens being hurt or killed.