Dear Prudence: My Fiancé Cut Off His Entire Family. Uh, Red Flag?

[minoanmiss]

content advisory: child abuse, arrant idiocy

Q. Red Flag or Reasonable?: I’m a woman who recently got engaged to my boyfriend of four years, “Mark.” In most areas of life, Mark is a kind, forgiving, considerate, and warm person. The exception is with regard to his blood relations. He is estranged from his family, and whenever he talks about them (rarely), it is with genuine hatred and contempt that I find disconcerting.

For context, his dad was an abusive alcoholic who put Mark in the hospital twice before he left home at 17. His dad hit his mom regularly but never laid a hand on Mark’s sister, who was openly his favorite child. His grandparents apparently knew about it but did not interfere beyond letting Mark stay with them sometimes. Mark cut off contact when he moved and in recent years, has ignored social media messages from his mom and sister begging to reconnect. He showed me the messages in the context of commenting, “Can you believe these people?” He seemed frustrated when I found the messages heart-breaking—both women seem to miss him terribly, though I admit it is bad that his mom is still married to his dad (who she claims is sober now).

I am from an incredibly loving, close-knit family who all love Mark. With news of the wedding, there have been questions about who we’re inviting, and people have asked about Mark’s family. His response is always brisk: “I don’t speak to any of them” and he changes the subject when pressed (only my parents know his history). I’ve tentatively raised the possibility of responding to his mom and sister, or getting in touch with his grandparents—he doesn’t even know if they’re still alive! I’ve told him that while I fully understand cutting off his dad, it seems incredibly harsh to not even give his mom and sister a chance to reconnect—his mom was a victim too, and his sister was only 14 when he left. A lot might have changed! His response is always the same: “I cannot speak to them, and my therapist doesn’t think it would be good for me. There are things you can’t get over.” I find this really troubling, honestly. My parents recently asked if he was sure about not reaching out to any family at all, and were shocked when he bluntly said that “for all intents and purposes” his family is dead to him. Should I consider it a red flag that he can so brutally cut off his entire family like this? I find it hard to imagine cutting off the people who raised me, whatever they did to me. Am I wrong to be so troubled by this? What more should I say to him, either way?


A: You’re not wrong to be troubled but you would be very, very, very wrong to go into a marriage hoping to convince someone to make changes to the way he’s dealing with his abusive childhood. This is a big deal. If you can make peace with Mark’s stance—or at least do a really good job of pretending to—you can go ahead and get married. But if you’re going to continue to be bothered that he isn’t handling things the way you would and fantasize about pressuring him to change his mind, well, that’s the kind of stuff divorces are made of.

Comments

[princessofgeeks]

She can't understand why he wants no contact with a dad who put him in the hospital twice as a teenager, while all the other relatives just stood there?

WTAF

That Bad Advice

[minoanmiss]

LW: you should absolutely call Mark out on his selfish ingratitude towards the people who gave him life. Tell him that because he abandoned his father, who only put him in the hospital a few times, and his mother who at best could not prevent this and at worst may well have enabled it, and his sister, who was the Golden Child and likely too young to not believe she and Mark deserved their disparate treatment, that you can't trust him not to abandon you the next time you forget to wash the dishes. Point out how ungrateful he is when all parents everywhere love us unconditionally and always mean what's best for us. Tell him that because "find it hard to imagine cutting off the people who raised me, whatever they did to me" there is no way any rational person could do so because you can fit the whole universe into your imaginings.

Then apologize to him for wasting four years of his life and give him the ring back and let him find someone who might have some goddamn empathy for the deep emotional and possible physical scars he carries.

.... I might have opinions about this one.

[conuly]

Yeah, maybe Mark could, in some alternate universe, forgive his younger sister for being the golden child. Maybe a reasonable person would do that!

But. Like. I mean... he was abused? Badly? And his mom and grandparents let it happen? I can get why he's not willing to forgive any of them, including the one who is at least technically blameless. He's under no obligation to be reasonable about this!

[julian]

"I find it hard to imagine cutting off the people who raised me, whatever they did to me."

Well, lady, I'm glad you haven't had to deal with such experiences, but no, in fact, you should not consider it a red flag, because it's *totally reasonable* not to want to a) talk to you abuser, or b) the people who stuck with him *despite* his abuse.

[adrian_turtle]

It is absolutely a red flag, but perhaps not in the way LW thinks. Her discomfort with his way of coping with his past abuse is a tremendous red flag for the future of their marriage. Put the wedding on hold until she can deal with her emotions around this and become a solid ally to her fiance. If she can't, she should end the engagement. Over the years, he's going to encounter people like her parents who think it's more important for a child to forgive a parent than for an adult to protect a vulnerable child, and he should have a partner who can support him.

I'm not sure if Prudence is trying to say, "Yes, this is all very upsetting, but you need to be able to deal with it if you're going to marry this person." Or if she's validating LW's position.

[teaotter]

I want this to be rage-bait so bad. This is like the before-picture of one of the AITA threads where someone secretly invites the abusive family to the wedding to force a rapprochement. It's such an enraging lack of respect for their supposedly-beloved partner.

And I worry about LW being an enabler themselves. What if one of their children is beaten by a cousin, would LW force their child to continue to see their abuser? How distant does the relationship have to be before "family first" allows for protecting your kid?

LW seems to be one of those people who wants everyone to get along more than they want everyone to be safe. They're disturbed that their fiance isn't willing to smooth things over. Is that a red flag? Yes, but on LW's side.

[green_grrl]

Mom is still living with Dad. And it doesn’t sound like Sister has said, “Wow, Dad was so toxic. Glad I’m out of there and I’m never speaking to him again.” So, NC is the healthiest thing fiancé can do for himself.

[firecat]

Mark would be better off with a partner who gets it to some extent, or at least trusts him to make choices that are right for him.

[tielan]

OOF.

I find it hard to imagine cutting off the people who raised me... But I was raised by good, loving, kind people.

Other people were not raised by my parents, my community.

Dear LW, I think that Mark's boundaries and his willingness to enforce them is a sign of an excellent person, and one who is dedicated to his own healing. He is not you. His scars are not yours. Leave him in peace and don't pester him about his family anymore. Some things are, indeed, unforgivable.

[mildred_of_midgard]

I went no-contact with my family over a lot less than this! Good for Mark for setting healthy boundaries.

[movingfinger]

The red flags are not where LW thinks they are.

[laurajv]

...

I'm married to someone whose abusive father I never met. As far as we know, said father never found out that his only child was married, nor knew what state we lived in, nor knew of the existence of his grandchildren. This has never troubled me one bit. I'm pretty sure that if I had ever once suggested to my spouse that he get back in touch with his father, I would not now be married to him.

Leave people who leave their abusive families THE FUCK ALONE. They made their choices and you can either respect it or join the ranks of their abusers.