Dear Abby: Petite trail walker wants a snappy comeback for off-leash dog owners

[petrea_mitchell]

First letter here.

DEAR ABBY: I live in an area with a large number of dog owners who frequent the same walking trails I do. On several occasions, I have encountered dogs that are off-leash and running ahead of their owners. Sometimes the owner isn’t even in sight.

On several occasions, dogs have jumped up on me, almost knocking me to the ground. I’m in my late 60s, under 5 feet and weigh 105 pounds. I could easily be injured. I was once attacked and bitten.

My question is this: What’s the best thing to say to these dog owners when they finally appear? The last time it happened, the owner happily said to her DOG, “I know you’re excited, but ...” The rest I couldn’t hear because she had already passed me on the trail.

Abby, she saw her dog jump up on me and never even acknowledged me. I don’t want to respond angrily or sarcastically, but in a friendly yet firm manner. -- WALKER IN WASHINGTON

DEAR WALKER: You are far too nice, lady. Start carrying pepper spray or bear spray when you walk on the trail. If an off-leash dog starts to jump on you, use it. When the owner shows up, say their dog charged you and take their picture. If they give you any trouble, file a police report. When you were bitten, you should have involved the authorities and your attorney.

Comments

[petrea_mitchell]

Willing to cosign calling the law when you are bitten, but bear spray is potentially fatal to any creature smaller than a bear, do not come armed with that unless you expect to encounter actual bears.

[jadelennox]

yeah, like, these people are dangerous assholes at worst, oblivious everyone-loves-doggie-jumps dog owners at the absolute best, but if you bear spray someone's dog prepare to go to court. And also make damn sure you know how not to get yourself (ouch) or any other humans on the path (assault).

[ioplokon]

Is there a good option if you want to not be bit? (I'm not thinking of excitable dogs but like full on mean ones, which I do encounter sometimes & idk what to do...)

[minoanmiss]

I second your questiion !

[cimorene]

That's what I was thinking. Maybe there's a pepper spray that's milder? I wouldn't want anything that is gonna be fatal. Maybe one of those things that makes a really really loud noise - is it an air horn?

[laurajv]

This...isn't quite what you asked, but it's probably good info: if you are confronted by a dangerous dog, you should keep an eye on it (not stare into its face, but don't turn your back, either), and you should be prepared in case it jumps at your face/throat -- be ready to bring up your NON-DOMINANT arm, bony-side out, across your throat. This is the body part you want to sacrifice to a bite.

If your balance is good enough and you weigh enough/are strong enough, you can bang a dog off you with a sharp knee to the chest, but get that arm up regardless. It can save your life. You do not want a dangerous dog getting to your face or throat.

[ioplokon]

Thanks. ooooh the knee seems risky - either you get the dog off or you're probably knocked to the ground 😬

[laurajv]

Yes -- that's part of why you need to weigh enough; you need to have the mass to keep from being bowled over.

[minoanmiss]

Ugh I prefer to avoid the police. They will side with the Whiter and or wealthier person. Not necessarily the bite victim.

And pepper spraying the dog if someone willing to let it knock one over is calling for being assaulted by the human too. One would be in the right but that won’t pay the hospital bills.

So I find this advice useless and share the LW’s need for a useful answer.

[cimorene]

+1 on police. Attorney if you are going to need it for medical bills, maybe.

[cora]

I hate this answer, but I think it's a "making the best of a bad situation" scenario: Pick a different walking trail/walk your dog elsewhere. It sucks because LW isn't the problem, but the only thing in life we can control is ourselves. Choosing not to put ourselves in such dangerous situations is the wise choice here, even if it's a shitty one.

[minoanmiss]

In personal practice, this is one reason why I don't go hiking and rarely go to parks, yeah. But there's a tiny part of me that doesn't want to recommend to LW that if all the local trails have this issue that she just stay home. (which is moot because she can't read this discussion anyway. ahahaha.)

[cora]

Yeah if all of the local trails have this problem, it may be time to look around at local parks and go there to walk in circles instead (super boring). I imagine people are more inclined to leash dogs around kids.

Locally we have a dog park. It specifically states dogs must be on a leash. I have no idea how common dog parks are, though.

[jerusha]

I work at a law firm that handles personal injury cases (although I do not handle them myself). And WOW, the number of dog bite cases we get. So, while I don't necessarily agree with the pepper/bear spray bit, I do think if you're bitten, you should absolutely should file a report and get an attorney, if only to cover your medical bills.

[minoanmiss]

Yeah but by the time one picks inself up the dog and owner have skippped happily off diwn the trail. People like this won’t exchange info if at all possible.

[jerusha]

True, but if it's a serious enough bite, it's probably still worth the attempt. There might be cameras at park entrances, and if you can snap a picture of the owner, you might get lucky. It's not a great solution, but it's something.

[julian]

The thing is, if they're frequent fliers, then their information/general description is probably known to the dog officer. So even IF they won't exchange information (which I think is actually rather rare, people have accommodating instincts), you can at least report time/date/general description to the relevant person.

[lilysea]

Yes, in my local suburb there is a dog park where people and dogs have been attacked by off leash dogs

(well behaved off leash dogs are allowed at the park, but we're talking about dogs that have repeatedly bitten people and other dogs, who should not be off leash)

and there are some repeat offenders who have refused to give their name
who have been identified by someone taking a photo and posting it to the local community Facebook group and/or also talking to the local council ranger.

[conuly]

LW, two little words: Fuck you. That's what you say to these people. "Fuck you, and fuck your dog too."

[adrian_turtle]

This might actually be a good place for women's tears. Maybe a good loud scream of terror or pain when the dog jumps on her. (Though I don't know if an untrained dog [or one trained to jump on people in excited greeting] is likely to react violently to screaming.) I understand the shocked impulse to freeze and try to act like you're in control of the situation. To think in terms of "I might have been attacked" rather than "I was just attacked." But that illusion of control makes it easier for other people to ignore what just happened, to not take it seriously.

[mrissa]

Right, I was going to say: screaming may agitate a previously annoying-but-nonviolent dog into a violent dog if it has been trained badly. It is extremely difficult to actually stay as safe as possible and convey to the other person that their actions endangered you in this situation.

This winter when he was in California, my partner was attacked by three dogs who were loose and ran 100 yards to attack him (that is: he was not close up and did not, could not have done anything to antagonize them). He is a large man and was not knocked down by being hit by three dogs running at top speed, and he was able to keep his head and shout, "NO NO NO," in a large commanding voice, so I am able to tell you this as "was attacked" rather than "required major surgery" or "was killed." Meanwhile here where we live, a man was killed by four dogs that same week. I love dogs. I am about the biggest dog lover you will find. That's why I want them well-trained and leashed in public areas, and I agree that getting through to the owners is a good long-term goal--but immediate safety has to come first.

[katiedid717]

I am not a dog person - like, I don't actively dislike dogs, but I would be perfectly fine if dogs suddenly disappeared from the world. There's a lake in my area with walking trails where dog owners are allowed/encouraged to let their dogs off leash so I just...choose not to go to that lake if I want to take a walk. Maybe the letter writer needs to go to a different park.

[lilysea]

The problem is that you find off leash dogs

even at parks with giant signs saying "dogs mush be on a leash"

and parks with giant signs saying "no dogs"

[firecat]

They don't mean MYYYYY dogs!

[katiedid717]

I haven't run into that problem as much where I live buuut it's probably because there are actual designated dog parks. Plus I live in a pretty traffic-heavy area, so people are already used to having their dogs leashed outside so they won't get hit by cars.

[lilysea]

Where I live there are designated dog-parks and designated dog-beaches

BUUUUUUT

people still take their dog with them to the not!Dogbeach and let it off leash

I got attacked by a German Shepherd that lunged at my throat (I was sitting in a power wheelchair) and had to fend it of with my umbrella for several minutes before the owner finally ambled around the blind corner and shrugged

not only was the dog off leash, the owner didn't even have eyes on it!

(It was in an area with lots of corners, high walls etc affecting visibility, and he'd let the dog run 50 metres ahead of him off leash)

and that was in a "no dogs off leash" area

[azurelunatic]

For dogs with some semblance of obedience training, and if you have notice that they're considering jumping, and if it seems safe, turn away from the dog. This is body language discouraging, and signals to the dog that you do not want to play.

[laurajv]

I would say, do not turn ALL the way. Turn your shoulder/side (preferably non-dominant) to the dog, keeping it in your peripheral vision. This will work fairly well even on dogs without much obedience training, provided they are mostly looking to greet you and not to attack you, because they ARE, as a species, pretty good at reading human body language.

If the dog is looking to attack you -- well, that's why you want to keep it in your peripheral vision, so that you know what it is doing.