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(no subject)
Dear Pay Dirt,
My daughter “Isabella” is married to a successful young lawyer and is eight months pregnant with their first child. My first wife and I wanted more children, but it never happened. She lost her battle with cancer when Isabella was 16. I didn’t feel like dating again for almost five years. Over the next few years I saw several women, none very seriously. Then, at Isabella’s wedding in 2019, I connected with one of her bridesmaids, “Madison,” a lovely young woman I’d last seen as a gawky teenager. Isabella was shocked when she found out Madison and I were dating, but didn’t expect it to last long. But I just proposed to Madison, and she accepted. I took Isabella out to lunch to tell her. For a minute she almost had a meltdown, but got herself together and said she hopes we are happy together.
Later that night I got an email stating she’s worried about her inheritance if Madison and I have children. Specifically, she’s afraid my house—a beautiful and unique 1884 Victorian which Isabella grew up in from birth, and is deeply attached to—will go to Madison upon my death, and then to my children with Madison, instead of to her and her children. She feels this would be especially unfair because her mother and I were gifted the house by my in-laws.
So, while she says this is hard for her, she’s decided to disallow me any relationship with her unborn son and any future children of hers unless I either transfer the house to her and myself as joint tenants, so she will automatically inherit my share, or to an irrevocable trust with her and her children as beneficiaries. This would prevent me from making a will, then changing it once she’s seen it. She says it’s fine if I give Madison a life estate so she could continue to inhabit the property, along with Isabella’s family, unless she remarries.
Isabella doesn’t even know that Madison wants children. But she does, and I think I’m up for it. I’m in my early 50s, in excellent shape, and my parents and grandparents all lived to at least 80. But from the moment I learned Isabella was pregnant, I’ve also had my heart set on being a grandpa. Should I do as she suggests? Would joint tenancy or a trust be preferable? My biggest concern is that the value of the house (currently over $2 million) may exceed the whole rest of my estate, especially after raising and educating several more children. And Madison has come to love this house as well. In fact, she claims she fell in love with it the first time she came over, in middle school. What would be fair for everyone?
—Vied For Victorian
Dear Vied For Victorian,
I understand your daughter’s discomfort with the situation—you can imagine how you’d feel if your widowed mother married one of your high school friends—but it’s unreasonable for her to try to extort you with the threat of withholding access to your grandchild if you don’t give her the house. And I wonder if Isabella would have the same expectations if you had married someone your own age and, as such, were not going to have children in the future.
Since you don’t have any children with Madison at the moment, but plan to, I would hesitate to do anything that you can’t modify later if circumstances change, or your future children need things you didn’t anticipate, especially while they’re still minors. You need something flexible.
Isabella needs to accept that Madison is going to be your wife, and that you have obligations to her that are permanent. She is not an interloper, and for inheritance purposes, should be treated the same way you’d treat anyone you married and planned to grow old with.
But understand also that it must be exceedingly difficult for Isabella to have to readjust her relationship with Madison. If she was a bridesmaid, I assume they were close, and it probably feels to her like Madison has betrayed her and maybe you have, too. Isabella may feel like she’s being displaced in your life by someone who was a close friend.
Madison, likewise, needs to understand why Isabella is so attached to the house and try to put herself in Isabella’s shoes. She may have known your family for a long time, but she did not grow up in the house, and cannot possibly have the same attachment to it.
I think your best option here is to meet with an estate lawyer and look at options that might satisfy both parties, with the idea that you want to be equitable. Sometimes a third-party recommendation can mitigate the emotional drama around issues like these, and give you a way to reasonably and truthfully say you’re trying to do what is fairly standard in these situations. Be clear with both of them that you are not going to play favorites, and threats will not change that.
https://slate.com/business/2022/07/daughter-inheritance-house-finance-advice.html
My daughter “Isabella” is married to a successful young lawyer and is eight months pregnant with their first child. My first wife and I wanted more children, but it never happened. She lost her battle with cancer when Isabella was 16. I didn’t feel like dating again for almost five years. Over the next few years I saw several women, none very seriously. Then, at Isabella’s wedding in 2019, I connected with one of her bridesmaids, “Madison,” a lovely young woman I’d last seen as a gawky teenager. Isabella was shocked when she found out Madison and I were dating, but didn’t expect it to last long. But I just proposed to Madison, and she accepted. I took Isabella out to lunch to tell her. For a minute she almost had a meltdown, but got herself together and said she hopes we are happy together.
Later that night I got an email stating she’s worried about her inheritance if Madison and I have children. Specifically, she’s afraid my house—a beautiful and unique 1884 Victorian which Isabella grew up in from birth, and is deeply attached to—will go to Madison upon my death, and then to my children with Madison, instead of to her and her children. She feels this would be especially unfair because her mother and I were gifted the house by my in-laws.
So, while she says this is hard for her, she’s decided to disallow me any relationship with her unborn son and any future children of hers unless I either transfer the house to her and myself as joint tenants, so she will automatically inherit my share, or to an irrevocable trust with her and her children as beneficiaries. This would prevent me from making a will, then changing it once she’s seen it. She says it’s fine if I give Madison a life estate so she could continue to inhabit the property, along with Isabella’s family, unless she remarries.
Isabella doesn’t even know that Madison wants children. But she does, and I think I’m up for it. I’m in my early 50s, in excellent shape, and my parents and grandparents all lived to at least 80. But from the moment I learned Isabella was pregnant, I’ve also had my heart set on being a grandpa. Should I do as she suggests? Would joint tenancy or a trust be preferable? My biggest concern is that the value of the house (currently over $2 million) may exceed the whole rest of my estate, especially after raising and educating several more children. And Madison has come to love this house as well. In fact, she claims she fell in love with it the first time she came over, in middle school. What would be fair for everyone?
—Vied For Victorian
Dear Vied For Victorian,
I understand your daughter’s discomfort with the situation—you can imagine how you’d feel if your widowed mother married one of your high school friends—but it’s unreasonable for her to try to extort you with the threat of withholding access to your grandchild if you don’t give her the house. And I wonder if Isabella would have the same expectations if you had married someone your own age and, as such, were not going to have children in the future.
Since you don’t have any children with Madison at the moment, but plan to, I would hesitate to do anything that you can’t modify later if circumstances change, or your future children need things you didn’t anticipate, especially while they’re still minors. You need something flexible.
Isabella needs to accept that Madison is going to be your wife, and that you have obligations to her that are permanent. She is not an interloper, and for inheritance purposes, should be treated the same way you’d treat anyone you married and planned to grow old with.
But understand also that it must be exceedingly difficult for Isabella to have to readjust her relationship with Madison. If she was a bridesmaid, I assume they were close, and it probably feels to her like Madison has betrayed her and maybe you have, too. Isabella may feel like she’s being displaced in your life by someone who was a close friend.
Madison, likewise, needs to understand why Isabella is so attached to the house and try to put herself in Isabella’s shoes. She may have known your family for a long time, but she did not grow up in the house, and cannot possibly have the same attachment to it.
I think your best option here is to meet with an estate lawyer and look at options that might satisfy both parties, with the idea that you want to be equitable. Sometimes a third-party recommendation can mitigate the emotional drama around issues like these, and give you a way to reasonably and truthfully say you’re trying to do what is fairly standard in these situations. Be clear with both of them that you are not going to play favorites, and threats will not change that.
https://slate.com/business/2022/07/daughter-inheritance-house-finance-advice.html
no subject
…until HER FATHER MADE A MOVE ON ONE OF HER CLOSEST FRIENDS (or vice versa) AT HER ACTUAL WEDDING, and that’s a pretty messed-up violation of the social contract.
Since she’s willing to give Madison life tenancy (i.e., she wouldn’t be forced to move out if Dad dies), I think that stipulating that the house goes to Isabella and her child/ren is reasonable.
Isabella has a reason to feel betrayed and displaced here.
Her father, at least, should have known better than to date/marry one of his daughter’s closest friends who was a middle-school-aged child when he met her. Ugh.
no subject
this, this, and this. And the fact that Madison responded to it...
Like, there are women in their 20s who are genuinely attracted to men in their 50s, and maybe Madison is one of those women. It happens! Probably often!
But it seems pretty clear that Isabella thinks her former close friend is a gold digger and her dad is a chump. She might be right or wrong, but given that the dad's version of this -- which is as complimentary to dad and Madison as it can possibly be -- looks completely inappropriate on Madison's part and gross on the LW's, I think it's legit for Isabella to draw any damn lines she wants.
Also, Elizabeth's advice is objectively bad, ethics aside. "Isabella needs to accept" and "Madison needs to understand" -- Elizabeth, neither of these women wrote to you! LW can control one person, and that is LW. Isabella made an ultimatum. LW can try to address the fears (rational or otherwise) behind the ultimatum with his daughter, or he can give in to them, or he can talk to an estate lawyer about a third option. He cannot change Isabella's feelings or Madison's.