conuly: (Default)
conuly ([personal profile] conuly) wrote in [community profile] agonyaunt2019-09-06 08:16 pm

Family Friend Sees Generosity as Charity

DEAR MISS MANNERS: I have three children who grew up as close friends to a neighbor of their age. She was (and is) treated as my third daughter, included in trips, etc. At the time, we were not well off financially, but she shared in what we had.

Many years have passed, and she is married with two children. She and her husband both work, but they are not as prosperous as one or two of my children. She and her family are still included in our family vacations, some of which are chosen based on the financial strain it will put on them to travel.

In the past, I have paid their hotel bill, but it led to an almost knock-down-drag-out fight with her husband, who looked on my gesture as charity.

As I explained to him, some of us are more fortunate than others in the financial area, through no fault or skill of either. What is the point of having money if I can’t spend it (in reasonable amounts) so that I can enjoy things with friends and family?

Her son is graduating high school and will be going away to college, primarily on scholarship. I want to send him more than a token cash gift. How do I do that without entering into a discussion that will cause hurt feelings? Can I gift him directly and ask him not to tell his parents? Seems rather underhanded and deceitful.

Do I have a frank discussion with the parents before sending him something? Any suggestions?


GENTLE READER: Assuring his father that it was not his fault that he is poor does not appear to have gone over well.

Putting aside the question of whether or not this should have come as a surprise, it should have been a warning. That you have money, and are willing to share it, does not exempt you from considering others’ feelings. If being the recipient of your generosity makes them uncomfortable, Miss Manners urges you to moderate your giving -- not find better ways to push your generosity on them. And do not send cash as a present to their son.
likeaduck: Spock tries to loosen the bars of a cell where he and McCoy are imprisoned. Text: Rose, I'm trying to resonate concrete (dammit jim i'm a vulcan not the doctor)

[personal profile] likeaduck 2019-09-07 01:42 am (UTC)(link)
Oh Miss Manners, I have so much nostalgia for you, but...weird patriarchal call? Send your pseudo-grandchild who is basically an adult money if you and he are cool with it, and who cares about his dad's (?) weird pride?
minoanmiss: Theran girl gathering saffron (Saffron-Gatherer)

[personal profile] minoanmiss 2019-09-07 05:54 am (UTC)(link)
Is it me or is Miss Manners missing a lot here?

Not that I know how I'd advise LW. It seems deeply inappropriate to encourage a kid (even one old enough to go to college) to lie to their parents, but it seems futile and sad to let a kid go without useful resources due to his father's overweening pride.
lemonsharks: (Default)

[personal profile] lemonsharks 2019-09-07 04:55 pm (UTC)(link)
I disagree a little with the inappropriateness of encouraging a kid to lie to their parents as a blanket statement--most of the time it's a solid take, but I think it's important to teach kids to value their safety over complete honesty with their progenitors and to learn that some things are none of their parents' business.

If a queer kid I know needs my help lying to their parents I will not only encourage but aid and abet them. If I know a kid whose parents are fighting their right to an abortion, I will happily drive them across state lines or give them crash space and money to achieve that, and I'll gladly help cover for them when they get home. That's safety stuff. If a kid in my life wants to go to a Quaker meeting but thinks their jerk atheist dad is going to emotionally abuse them for it, I think it's reasonable for the kid to tell them they were at the library getting cozy with Richard Dawkins' Greatest Hits, instead. Safety comes before parents' hurt feelings, and if parents like the above don't like it then they should try sucking less.

None of their business scenarios are harder. Like ... say Youngest Child has celiac disease. the entire family is gluten free both in solidarity with YC and because it's easier to avoid cross-contamination at home that way. Parents REALLY push the solidarity angle, though, and scold or judge their other children for eating the occasional glutenous doughnut. It is absolutely none of their business whether Older Child uses his babysitting money to go to town on a chowder bread bowl and sandwich at Panera, assuming he washes up thoroughly before removing toys, et al, from YC's mouth.

Similarly, I think a gift from honorary grandma to her adult adoptive grandson is none of his dad's business, and that this is a really good point in time for grandson to learn that he isn't obligated to share everything about his life with his parents.

In practice it's harder, but I think a good compromise would be paying any/all student loans/credit cards grandson accrues while he's in college after he either graduates or quits so he can start his postgrad life debt-free, while sending a chunky gift card someplace fun every couple of months while he's in school.
minoanmiss: A detail of the Ladies in Blue fresco (Default)

[personal profile] minoanmiss 2019-09-07 05:32 pm (UTC)(link)

Oh, I definitely agree with you on any and all of these situations, and you have come up with an excellent solution to this particular quandary. makes note

cimorene: cartoony drawing of a woman's head in profile giving dubious side-eye (Default)

[personal profile] cimorene 2019-09-07 09:41 am (UTC)(link)
This person seems to have a rather common wealthier family member or upper middle class attitude to money, which is understandably alienating to some people with less (even if it only works on ones who were already sensitive or taking it Very Seriously, it becomes a sore point only because the rich relative is pushy and insensitive about it). They're being pretty unfair to their friend by squishing her between their pressure and her spouse's feelings, but the question at hand is more... what kind of magic suggestion do they think an advice columnist would have that would suddenly make the kid's dad change his entire outlook on life or whatever? There are no magic words, lady. This isn't a Jeeves and Wooster story. If the kid's 18, they're free to accept monetary gifts or not on their own behalf, but you're not getting away with something like this without creating conflict between either you and the dad or the kid and the dad, or both.
misbegotten: A skull wearing a crown with text "Uneasy lies the head" (Default)

[personal profile] misbegotten 2019-09-07 10:41 am (UTC)(link)
I'm fangirling over your comment. Well said.
minoanmiss: Theran girl gathering saffron (Saffron-Gatherer)

[personal profile] minoanmiss 2019-09-07 03:58 pm (UTC)(link)
You deserve whatever money MM got paid, as your answer is infinitely better.