agonyaunt | (no subject)

Dear Eric: For the past 10 years we have always “been there” for our grandchildren (now 18 and 16) and my son and daughter-in-law.

In the past two years, things have changed. We have sent the grandkids cards, asked them to various events and sent weekly texts. Most go unanswered, as if they are entitled. So, I recently sent them a text and gently reminded them to 1. respond when spoken to, 2. respond when they receive a text, 3. acknowledge cards and letters, and 4. generally respect family ties and elders. Basic social skills that they should have learned by now.

This recent text seems to have driven a wedge between my daughter-in-law and us. She has since restricted my texts/communications with the grandkids. Her statement is that the kids “are too busy.” They don't have time to say “thanks” or even acknowledge or respond back to anything.

My son has gone underground, and we have not heard from him, or see where he stands on this. My daughter-in-law is a “helicopter mom” who is involved in every aspect of the kids’ lives. It seems that my daughter-in-law’s outburst and overreaction may have been bubbling up for a while.

— Restricted Grandparents

Grandparents: Unless your son is in the CIA, or an actual mole, he needs to come join the rest of you and work through this family issue. You can help this along by reaching out to him directly and saying, “I think we got our wires crossed; can we talk about it?”

I doubt it’s a secret that you think of your daughter-in-law as a helicopter mom, so it’s likely her outburst was, as you suspect, the result of a most long-standing set of gripes and perceived slights. And it’s hard to read tone over text, so your reminder to your grandkids probably came across as you disciplining her kids. For her, that crossed a line, and she set a boundary.

The way out of this is to have a face-to-face conversation with your son and daughter-in-law. Ask them if they feel you overstep or don't respect their parenting. And listen to what they have to say. Then, express your hope for your relationship with your grandkids. You have an unmet expectation that's crashing into another narrative that's going on in that house. You won't untangle it until you're able to talk about what's really important to each of you and what everyone's boundaries are.

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So, first of all, these kids are late teens. Their mommy and daddy are no longer in control of their social interactions and it is ludicrous that LW thinks that's what's going on. DIL isn't cutting off their communication with the teens, although she may be running interference on their behalf.

Also - LW has been there for the past ten years. Where, uh, where exactly were these people for the 8 years prior to that?

Underground. Where their son is currently.

For some inexplicable reason (probably the DIL’s fault)

Underground. Where their son is currently.

🎼No one can blame him
For walking away…🎶

Where, uh, where exactly were these people for the 8 years prior to that?

"For the past 10 years" is a weird thing to say but there are some logical possibilities. It's son's 2nd marriage and the kids are DIL's? LW's son and DIL adopted the kids 10 years ago? LW and spouse moved closer to their son's family, or vice versa, 10 years ago?

I like the "LW and spouse were underground" though.

Witness protection....

Grandparents, you should have learned following basic social facts by now: (1) Your family members are human beings who get to choose whom they interact with. They are not your pets. This means if they don't respond to repeated overtures, you need to accept that they don't want to. Respect that and leave them alone. (2) One of the ruder things a person can do is tell another human being their behavior is rude. (3) Human beings generally don't like interacting with people who disapprove of them and dismiss their choices as "overreactions."

My pets also get to choose their interactions. I spent several futile minutes today trying to entice my dog off my sister's lap and onto my own!

I don't even know LW, and I wanted to block LW on my phone and email after reading this letter!

LW's text was definitely gentle and LW's DIL definitely overreacted, these are just objective facts that LW cannot help but report objectively. Yep. When anyone yells at me that I have to answer them whenever they want to text me, it increases my desire to interact with them and improves our relationship, UNLESS there's some kind of helicopter parent intervening to turn them against me. That's just facts as well.

(I wish, oh how I wish, people stopped using "entitled" for everything they don't like. Some people sure do act entitled, but I bet you money the grandchildren don't feel entitled to cards, texts, and invitations to things they don't want to do, they feel indifferent or possibly annoyed or baffled depending.)

The only person in this letter who definitely thinks they're entitled to something is LW.

Every time I read the words "gently reminded", "kindly pointed out", or variations thereof in an advice letter, I know the LW's perception of the event is not to be trusted.

Word.

Wow this is the tip of an ugly iceberg for sure.

Teen 1: avoiding you
Teen 2: avoiding you
Dad of teens: avoiding you
Mom of teens: issuing brief explanations for absence and not engaging further with you

It’s almost like you are the common denominator here, LW. When one person out of four avoids you, that doesn’t necessarily suggest a systemic issue. But when three out of four actively avoid you and the fourth, least-related-to-you person becomes the one who handles brief contact with you, that paints entirely a different picture.

But the DIL is right there! Let's blame her instead!

If LW is old enough to have teenaged grandchildren, they're old enough to have learned the "basic social skill" that if someone keeps turning down invitations and not answering your cards and texts, you should let them be, until and unless they reach out in turn.

I had to reread this after seeing the comments here to register that the grandchildren are being called "entitled" for not wanting to chat over text, and turning down or ignoring invitations. Usually, it's "we send them money and gifts and don't even get a thank you."

It doesn't sound as though the LW likes their grandchildren, the complaint is about not respecting family ties and elders. And the problem with Eric's advice is that it assumes that the letter writer's son and daughter-in-law would be available for that sort of face-to-face conversation. A message to their son, saying they didn't mean to overstep and would like to talk, might work, but not if it uses words like "outburst" and "overreaction."

It sounds like LW is so delusional that it's unlikely anything Eric could say would convince them to engage in meaningful exchange with their family or change the situation, though.

On the other hand, a sufficiently ridiculous reaction might be enough to get DIL to drop that rope, which is sure to make her life ever so much more pleasant in the long run.

Dear Restricted,

It seems that you are unaware of text message etiquette, where it's neither required nor possible to respond to every single text you get. Nor of the etiquette of the slow fade.

Did you get what you wanted, now that you've forced a confrontation?

There aren't very many things you can do, outside the realm of intentional harm and outright evil, that are less polite than presuming to give etiquette lessons to people who aren't your small children.

Imagine getting -- via text, no less! -- a "gentle reminder" that when I speak to you you have to speak back!

It was an unearned kindness for the daughter-in-law to respond to this fairly politely, instead of letting the son and the grandkids respond as they wished.