agonyaunt | Father/Son Rift Is Hurting All

Father/Son Rift Is Hurting All

Dear Annie: I am beside myself. I am tired and frustrated. I married my husband over 17 years ago. He is 11 years older than me. When we married, he had a teenage son. Shortly after we married, his son, in his senior year, decided to go live with his mother on the other side of the world. He would keep in touch with his dad by phone and visit once a year.

When my husband and I retired, we decided to move closer to his son, but we were still a long drive away. We gave up everything to move there. My husband is in his 80s. He is not in good health. He can no longer travel the distance to see his son.

His son has a nice family with a couple of children and a good job. When we first moved here, they would come to visit on occasion. But now, it is far fewer visits. I have asked his son on several occasions to just call his dad, maybe once a week. But for some reason, he couldn't do that.

We send them gifts on all of their birthdays and special occasions. We never hear from them if they received the gifts or if they liked them -- and there's never a thank-you note. Only after I would email them, asking if they received the items, did they respond. My husband has called his son several times and left messages. He never calls back.

I've watched my husband as he has cried several times over this situation. It pains my heart to see how this wears on my husband. When he was raising his son, his son was the world to him. Now, he feels his son hates him. Not a day goes by that he does not go into a tirade about his son's neglect.

He says he doesn't want anything to do with them. When he dies, he doesn't even want me to notify him. He made me promise to take his son out of our will when he dies. We have argued about this on several different occasions. I don't think he really means this. His son is his only living relative. I used to make excuses for his son, but I'm tired. I can't do it anymore. Help. -- At My Wits' End

Dear At My Wits' End: I am so sorry that you and your husband, and your stepson, are all going through this. Your stepson clearly has some animosity toward your husband that needs to be addressed. Instead of addressing it head-on, and talking through the issues, he is avoiding his father to prevent having a relationship.

It's no wonder that he is doing that because your husband's response to his son's withdrawal was the same reaction. He said to cut him out of the will and to not even tell his son when he dies. Like father, like son.

The only way to stop this cycle is for the two of them to have an open and honest conversation about their feelings. Although it can be painful to talk about hurtful things, once you do, it feels much better in the long run, and you can begin to understand the other person's point of view.

Encourage your husband to reach out to his son, one on one, and tell him how much not seeing his son has hurt him. Hopefully, they can work things out. To work through his resentment and hurt, your husband could always try therapy. It is easier to face emotions with a trained professional.

https://www.arcamax.com/healthandspirit/lifeadvice/dearannie/s-2383002

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... did the son WANT them to move closer, etc, etc and also etc?

I'm thinking not.

That was my first question as well. But am I reading correctly that the son continued to call and make annual visits, across the world, until his father and LW moved? And that the son's subsequent drives to see his father and LW didn't so much stop as taper off?

I'm not entirely sure what to think, but that sequence of events doesn't suggest anger to me. Maybe the son slowly realized the relationship was more work than it was worth, which... I don't love. OTOH I also can't imagine maintaining a relationship with someone prone to daily tirades. I definitely think LW is leaving something out.

It could go either way, but it's worth noting that it's common for children to try to maintain contact with their parents for a long time before giving up. People don't usually want to cut their parents off, so they keep calling and making visits. (It's also possible that the calls and visits were implicitly part of the deal if the Dad - or, less likely, Mom - was going to chip in for college, etc. Or even an explicit requirement.)

To be fair, it's possible that they couldn't get a house any closer than they did.

I'm confused at 'giving up everything to move closer', but having moved 'across the world' choosing a home that's an inconveniently long drive from the son's home. It seems like some weird controlling point is being made there.

I assumed it was because they couldn't afford to live closer - houses in rural or outer-suburban areas are a lot more affordable than houses in big cities.

I would suspect that moving to (say) central Tokyo is outside their budget, so they are stuck in some out-of-the-way suburb without social connections (or, plausibly, language skills to gain any) and haven't actually improved their "get to see son" time at all because of a combination of "actually local travel can sometimes be tougher than the international flight" and "he doesn't actually like you". If that was me I'd be seriously regretting my life choices.

I live 60 miles from my parents, it's two-three hours travel for me on the train (1 for them, they have a car) and we collectively manage it about twice a year... we get on much better on the phone.

I have no idea what's going on here, but a few things jump out at me.

1. Either LW was in Husband's life a lot longer than is sorta implied here, or, in fact, LW has no way of knowing if "his son was the world to him" because they just got there when the kid was finishing up high school.

2. If everything else is equal, it certainly does seem like most seniors in high school would prefer to stay with their friends and classmates rather than go all the way around the world to live with Mom. What happened here?

3. I notice that LW is the one who sends these follow-up emails after gifts, not Dad. And they don't respond to Dad's phone calls, apparently don't even answer the phone.

This all starts to sound less like a neglectful adult son (so neglectful that Dad goes into daily "tirades") and a lot more like somebody who has deliberately chosen to limit contact with a parent, despite the fact that the parent moved a long way (across the world?) to be closer to them.

And if that's the case, then, Annie, it's entirely possible that the Son has the right idea and there's nothing to be gained by "addressing it head-on and talking through the issues" that led to this estrangement.

Dear LW,

Something tells me that your husband was a shitty father to his son, and now that he is certifiably old has started feeling bad about it.

He made me promise to take his son out of our will when he dies.

This just struck me very oddly. Surely he has to do this himself? Before he dies? Otherwise it sounds like he's leaving his wife a legal nightmare.

Only if she bothers to respect those stated but not recorded wishes.

Their wills probably (assuming) both say "all to spouse, unless spouse is dead, then..." so if he dies first (looks likely...) she gets everything, and then she gets to decide what her will says, going forward. Changing one's will is unlikely to be free or totally trivial but it's not "a legal nightmare".

But it sounds as if son is already in will? I wonder if there may be a bit of a failing-mental-powers issue with the husband.

I was wondering about that, too. The tirades combined with the husband being in his 80s ping me pretty strongly as possible signs age related mental deterioration. The LW may be in denial about that aspect because it’s a much bigger problem, one that the LW is stuck with.

Most of my older relatives became very hard to talk to in their final years, and they wouldn’t remember phone calls or visits. Some just happily assumed that visits and calls were happening frequently while others were upset about not being visited even though they had been.

When my grandmother was in her late 70s and still living independently, I hesitated to visit her because she had strict ideas about what she had to do for guests. We didn’t have any place else nearby where we could stay. She lived too far away for a day visit.

I also wonder how old the son’s children are. It wouldn’t affect phone calls from the son so much, but it would have a huge impact on visits. There’s an age range when kids have to have a driver for all activities, have fairly full schedules, and will complain the entire time if dragged off to visit boring relatives.

What if you ... stop making excuses? What if you gently sympathize with your husband but try to be elsewhere when he goes on a rant? What if you stop trying to be a go-between for your husband and his son, and cultivate your own relationship with your stepson?

Uh...children are not vending machines that you put your version of love into and get love and consideration back?

But apart from the glib answer...this is that 'missing parenting' thing, isn't it? A whole story behind the scene that we're only being shown the final present scene of.

Yes, it sounds like the son and father may have relationship issues. But LW shouldn't be the mediator. Or the encourager. Or the enabler. (Whichever it is.) And if there's a relationship to be had, the son has got to want it too, which...sounds like he doesn't. So LW's hubs is gonna have to make his peace with that.

Also: his wife can't take his son out of his will when he dies. It's not possible and would be looked askance at from a legal perspective since she's likely the other main beneficiary.

I know so many people who stay in touch with their parents even tho it harms the adult child more than it helps the adult child,

and I am inclined to think that if the son has stopped calling and visiting, it is because calling/visiting harms the son more than it helps him.

Did someone go and copy a post out of the estranged parents boards? Because this letter is only this side of dripping with the kind of misdirection and "how could someone not love people so lovely as us?" blinders that is common in that community. I bet there is a whole lot more to this story if viewed from another perspective.

I mean, this sounds like a wonderful person I’d want to be in contact with... /s

Not a day goes by that he does not go into a tirade about his son's neglect.... When he dies, he doesn't even want me to notify him. He made me promise to take his son out of our will when he dies.

No way that anger, derision, and entitlement hasn’t been poisoning their relationship for a long time.

I think this advice is terrible. The first bit of advice should be about getting the husband's health checked. If this is a change in behavior or even a gradual increase in the crying and ranting, there's a non-zero chance that it's aging related. Given the comment about 'poor health,' it's quite possibly a thing the LW already knows but is ashamed of.

My second bit of advice would be to discuss what sort of long term care options the LW has if such become necessary. The LW has to be somewhere in her 70s if she's eleven years younger than a man in his 80s. I wonder how much of the LW's concern has to do with having sole responsibility for taking care of the husband in a worsening situation. Does the LW ever get respite? Most of the women I know in this age range would consider it shameful to ask for that sort of help directly.

So I'm kind of worried about her killing both of them by mixing something into the soup because she has no idea how she can manage any longer.

Just to add-- I'm not saying that the son doesn't (possibly) have excellent reasons for cutting contact. He might. His father might well always have been terrible. I'm just not sure that what the LW is really asking for is that he call so that his father will be less upset and less unpleasant.

The son is under no obligation to do anything at all, not even if his father was a perfect person before, and terrible people do still get sick.

I'm mostly concerned about what resources the LW has.

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